Hunting and Foraging

[Frederik]

Funny that, Pogo. As of late, my diet has to a very large extent come from kangaroo!

[olbeef]

Our participation in the food chain, as consumers of animal products, is neither alarming nor cause for celebration.  It is merely consistent with our place in the world, as capable opportunistic omnivores.

 

There is a large body of evidence indicating that optimal human nutrition requires animal products.

• Are factory farming methods abhorrent?  Should we look to minimise suffering?  Yes, but this is no indictment of meat in the human diet, but of the specific methods used to acquire it.
• Should we be eating the WHOLE animal?  Or at the very least, as much as is edible?  Absolutely.
• Should we be attempting to make better use of animals that are indigenous to the area?  Absolutely.
• Should we be eating a greater proportion of seafood, particularly in a country so bountiful?  Absolutely.

With respect to indigenous animals - the kangaroo in particular - it could be seen as a dereliction of duty NOT to eat them.  They exist in plague proportions, because in a country bereft of significant alternative predators, we are not living in harmony with the land, and consuming them as did the country's first people.

Our participation in the food chain could be considered the most alarming problem our survival on the planet faces.  Scarce and polluted resources should be at the top of our priorities.  Factory farming is just the most efficient way of using these resources to feed an ever expanding greed for flesh.  Whilst poorer parts of the world starve, livestock is fattened up by the billions.  No Biggie!

 

We are capable omnivores, does not make it ideal.  There is a large body of evidence showing excluding animal products can prevent and reverse some of our biggest killers.  Can you name any essential nutrients missed when not consuming flesh?  

 

If you consider seafood a bountiful food source the science disagrees.  Ocean numbers are in dramatic decline.  Along with every other ecosystem on the planet with animal food demand being the biggest driver. 

 

But none of this was my main point.  I was more shocked at the titillation some seemed to take in which type of barbaric torture one considered more pleasing.  Which century are we in?  Isn't the most noble, humane approach to inflict the least amount of pain and suffering.  Consider discussing any of the practices described here and swap the preyed upon for a pet dog or cat.  I imagine all members would be sickened and this group likely reported and publicly shamed.  

 

I vaguely recall an esteemed member prescribing living a life that is morally good.  To do none harm and it being better to suffer an injury than to inflict one

[jaja]

@olbeef

 

This is very much close to Jainist ethics, so I must remind you the most respected followers of Jainism used to let them die of starvation because they knew it's impossible to live without make other beings suffer; what I think everyone should do is to be aware of this fundamental truth and be grateful for every second he/she spends being alive. I think vegetarianism is great ((vegan diet could be a problem, though) and I probably will try it sometimes in the future, but I see nothing inherently “wrong” in eating flesh, as long as you're not “disconnected” while doing so.

 

Of course, this is my opinion and you are entitled to hold an entirely different one. Morality is a tricky topic: basically it all comes down to deeply hold opinions based on established patterns. This forum is all about re-patterning, which also requires to drop some of our most beloved concepts.

[Admin]

@ jaja: I applaud you. I thought about replying, but you have sketched the main points more neatly (and certainly more succinctly) that I would have. Thank you.

[olbeef]

On 15 May 2016 at 7:09 PM, jaja said:

@olbeef

 

This is very much close to Jainist ethics, so I must remind you the most respected followers of Jainism used to let them die of starvation because they knew it's impossible to live without make other beings suffer; what I think everyone should do is to be aware of this fundamental truth and be grateful for every second he/she spends being alive. I think vegetarianism is great ((vegan diet could be a problem, though) and I probably will try it sometimes in the future, but I see nothing inherently “wrong” in eating flesh, as long as you're not “disconnected” while doing so.

 

Of course, this is my opinion and you are entitled to hold an entirely different one. Morality is a tricky topic: basically it all comes down to deeply hold opinions based on established patterns. This forum is all about re-patterning, which also requires to drop some of our most beloved concepts.

At no point did I suggest takings one's life.  Likely the quote I shared, gave that impression.  What reasonable human can argue with living a life which seeks to exclude  as far as is possible and practicable, all forms of exploitation of, and cruelty to, animals for food, clothing or any other purpose?  What is left then is what information one chooses to consume. The perpetual growth in humans not consuming animals or their secretions and thriving at all levels of life diminish the argument of "need".   Minimising suffering should not be dismissed on the basis that elimination is impossible.  If you prescribe being grateful for every second of life, then how can ending a life unnecessarily not be considered disconnected?  

 

On 15 May 2016 at 7:09 PM, jaja said:

@olbeef

 

This is very much close to Jainist ethics, so I must remind you the most respected followers of Jainism used to let them die of starvation because they knew it's impossible to live without make other beings suffer; what I think everyone should do is to be aware of this fundamental truth and be grateful for every second he/she spends being alive. I think vegetarianism is great ((vegan diet could be a problem, though) and I probably will try it sometimes in the future, but I see nothing inherently “wrong” in eating flesh, as long as you're not “disconnected” while doing so.

 

Of course, this is my opinion and you are entitled to hold an entirely different one. Morality is a tricky topic: basically it all comes down to deeply hold opinions based on established patterns. This forum is all about re-patterning, which also requires to drop some of our most beloved concepts.