PNF/Contraction repetitions and strength for hamstrings

[Colin]

Hi everyone,

I've just started stretching again after many years of neglecting it. Generally I'm naturally very flexible, with the exception of my hamstrings which have always been ridiculously tight - when I did martial arts many years ago I was a hair away from a full side split but could barely touch my toes. I got the Master the Squat program and while there are definitely useful stretches there for me, I can already do a reasonable squat naturally so I've moved on to Master the Pike to start work on my hamstrings.

I have two questions. The first is about repetitions when doing PNF/contraction stretching. I've seen on these forums and elsewhere that for a particular stretch the contractions can be repeated a couple of times, say 3-5 or until no more benefit is being realised. I'm a bit unsure of how much I should be relaxing between repetitions - when discussing this style of stretching, "relax" seems to mean both "stop contracting" and "release the muscle from being stretched". Similarly between a contraction and the following stretch - in a few of the master videos Kit said that the body should be fully relaxed after a contraction, does that mean that e.g. in the lunge hamstring stretch after each contraction I should completely unload the hamstring? That stretch in particular is a fairly awkward position to be able to do that, at least for me, and watching the videos I don't get the impression that Kit is doing so. Should I be completely releasing the stretch between contraction repetitions for a particular stretch?

Also, it seems that part of contraction-style stretching is to develop strength in the muscle being stretched, which in turn allows the body to release it more. However with the hamstrings, it seems that extreme tightness like mine is often actually a protective mechanism for the lower back rather than weakness in the hamstrings themselves. Does this mean that I'd actually be better doing core strength exercises to complement stretching rather than explicit hamstring strengthening? Is there a good test to identify which is likely to be the problem? The only thing I can think of would be something like checking that I can do a roughly similar amount of weight on hamstring curls as on leg extensions to check for hamstring weakness, or something similar. 

Thanks for any advice,

Colin

[Kit_L]

Quote

in the lunge hamstring stretch after each contraction I should completely unload the hamstring? That stretch in particular is a fairly awkward position to be able to do that, at least for me, and watching the videos I don't get the impression that Kit is doing so.

Most definitely. As for how I look on the video, especially when I am both performing and editing (and writing, etc.), this is not a relaxing experience so I may not look as though I am relaxing— but when I am stretching for real (I mean for myself) I let every shred of tension go from the hamstrings slowly (to make sure they can take the lengthening). My abdomen is relaxed; I slow my breathing; I put all my awareness into the stretching–lengthening parts, and I wait. No tension, except in whatever muscles I am using to support the position. If you cannot relax in the lunge hamstring, either back the tension off a little or use a bolster for support under either leg, and relax on to that.

Re. MTS: many of the 'smaller' exercises are vital to your progress, and that is why they are in the first program.

Re. protective tension: very likely. So, when you are contracting (in time, that is) you will be wanting to use most, and in time, all of your strength for this. In the lunge hamstring exercise the lower back is completely protected. Work up to this, of course.

[Colin]

Thanks Kit, that's very helpful.

Re: MTS: sorry, I explained myself badly - I'm still using stretches from it when I can feel them in the hamstring stretches I'm doing - calves, hip flexors particularly, and also adding in some quadriceps as well, mostly because I feel them quite strongly in the lunge hip flexor stretch. It's just that the squat is not the main thing I'm working towards. At some point I'll come back and work on my ankle mobility some since that's really my main remaining restriction in the squat, but it doesn't limit me from doing the things I want to do to anywhere near the same extent as the hamstrings do.

Generally I'm doing calves, quads, hip flexors and then the hamstrings in that order, so trying to stretch out the secondary muscles I can feel in each stretch first. From MTP I'm really only doing the Elephant Walk and the lunge hamstring stretch right now, since the lunge stretch is really the only one I can do with proper form without compromising my lower back position. As that improves I'll add more in.

[Kit_L]

I would add the advanced piriformis to that mix, before the lunge hamstring. The lunge hamstring is the key to unlocking the hamstrings; the main reason is the same reason that protects the lower back: the HFs are trying to extend the lumbar spine via anterior pelvis tilt. This has the effect of keeping the lumbar spine flat, and moving the ischial tuberosities away from the knee, increasing hamstring stretch.

And, re-reading your original post, you asked if you should completely unload the hamstring (in the lunge hamstring exercises) when in the relax phase; I may not have had the second morning coffee when I replied. Load/unload is all relative: full contraction is a strong load, be definition. In that position, you cannot completely unload that muscle: even when trying to relax fully and when you are supported on a bolster, there is still load on the hamstrings (otherwise no stretch) as it is partly supporting the weight of the body.

So a better answer is, reduce the load to the point where you can genuinely relax. The actual tension  will vary between people and between different days. Whatever it is, you need to be able to relax in the face of (in the experience of) that tension—this is how you calibrate the amount to use. Too much tension? You will not be able to relax, so back it off. This is where a bolster can be so helpful; for effective stretching, you must be able to relax (soft tummy, regular nose breathing) in the final position.

[Colin]

Thanks Kit, that makes sense and answers my confusion about the lunge stretch perfectly. I'll experiment with all that and see how it feels, lots to try there.