Absolute Beginner's Stretching series

[Nathan]

On 2017/12/8 at 10:08 AM, Kit_L said:

Or might there be utility in including these anyway, to popularise them?

I would, personally. Think of these as hashtags specific to your "brand." You want generic hashtags to attract those unfamiliar with ST, but you want ST-specific hashtags as a way to promote ST specifically. They can also be used by ST teachers and practitioners to spread the word and connect with each other. I often find interesting people to follow by exploring hashtags that interest me, and I'm sure that's a common practice. It's probably even built in to recommendation algorithms used by the services to recommend accounts to follow, etc.

Regarding "more is better"... I would definitely emphasize "to a point." Too many/too general will appear spammy, and while it might draw more visitors potentially, it can also give a bad impression and draw the wrong kind of visitors. I would stick to around 10, like Olga mentioned she does, keeping the ST-specific hashtags in every post and changing up the general tags to represent the content of the post better.

[Jonas W]

I can help record the Swedish audio.

[Nathan]

I received an email from GMB (Ryan and crew) yesterday about captions being added to their videos. It is completely relevant to some of what we've discussed above and adds another perspective to the conversation, so I figured it wouldn't hurt to share the link here: Why We’ve Added Captions to Our Program Videos

[justinchien]

On 12/8/2017 at 10:05 PM, Nathan said:

Regarding "more is better"... I would definitely emphasize "to a point." Too many/too general will appear spammy, and while it might draw more visitors potentially, it can also give a bad impression and draw the wrong kind of visitors. I would stick to around 10, like Olga mentioned she does, keeping the ST-specific hashtags in every post and changing up the general tags to represent the content of the post better.

Just want to plus one to Nathan's comment. As an example, the constant posting from Gymnasticbodies on Facebook is a big turn-off to me. GMB's recurring email is a good reference as a cadence, in terms of frequency and content. I would be more conscious about using #. It's a good tool but there are too much of tagging out there to my taste. Sorry if I may sound a little grumpy to some... With a classy marketing, it would attract the people who are more sustainable to practice ST. 

-Justin 

PS: I think you got someone for Chinese for the video. My Chinese is still good if you still need any extra help.  

[MarkusO]

I have one more thought with regard to the audio that just crossed my mind. Kit, have you ever done any voice-over after the actual recording? That is, just recording the exercise and explaining them as a voice-over? I wonder how that would work. It could be easier to translate material into other languages as you would not need to deal with exact timings of what is said. On the other hand it might not be as enjoyable to watch, i am not sure. Just a thought :-) 

[Kit_L]

17 hours ago, MarkusO said:

Kit, have you ever done any voice-over after the actual recording?

Yes, and I have seen others do it too, but it is always 'flat'; these kinds of programs lack any spontaneity. I love the GMB work, but they use this  method from time to time, and it never works, IMHO. And the commentary that results never seems to capture all the essential info, either.

[MarkusO]

2 hours ago, Kit_L said:

Yes, and I have seen others do it too, but it is always 'flat'

Yes you are right. I was thinking along similar lines. Well, it was just an idea :-) I will give the dubbing a try before the end of the yer, lets see how that goes!

[SwissDanny]

1 hour ago, MarkusO said:

I will give the dubbing a try before the end of the yer, lets see how that goes!

This is going to be awesome, here's some inspiration:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U9t-slLl30E

 

[Kit_L]

@SwissDanny: that's brilliant dubbing (and that's what actors do in Hollywood; they record new soundtrack using their original ones as a reference guide; it's called ADR). We do not need anything as near as good/accurate for the new ABS programs, I believe. 

And idiomatic, natural German instructions, for example, with verbs at the end of sentences, is not going to fit easily into my, or Liv's words, but will be good enough, I think. What do others think?

[Nathan]

10 minutes ago, Kit_L said:

And idiomatic, natural German instructions, for example, with verbs at the end of sentences, is not going to fit easily into my, or Liv's words, but will be good enough, I think. What do others think?

That's the "art" of dubbing, and begins with a professional writing a dub script. I don't think we need to aim that high. We're not producing blockbusters and we don't need to immerse the viewer in the story. Our goal is to convey the necessary information so that the practitioner can get the most out of the movements, so we should prioritize natural, concise, and easy to understand instructions. Of course it certainly doesn't hurt if the dub syncs with the lip movements, but I think worrying about that would only impede progress.

[SwissDanny]

6 hours ago, Nathan said:

Of course it certainly doesn't hurt if the dub syncs with the lip movements, but I think worrying about that would only impede progress.

Although I try and avoid it, over the years I've spent a lot of time watching films dubbed into French, German, Italian etc, and even professional ADR (today I learned) dubbing into another language is still pretty unnatural, so the payback is imo definitely not worth the additional effort to script and perform.

I just watched Vimeo Elephant Walk and Lunge Hamstring sort imagining a simultaneous translation into French and German. Apart from the intro/outro most of the time your face/mouth is not the focus anyway so a voice-over rather than dub seems absolutely fine. What I also noted is that and you do talk fairly quickly and communicate a lot in a few words; English is such an efficient language compared to almost all others. I can see why non-native speakers have to really focus at times listening to the original videos.  I do think it is going to be helpful if you can consciously create some space in these new recordings (slower tempo, and some silences) for the other languages. 

But this is all theory, a test or two is in order.

[Kit_L]

21 hours ago, Nathan said:

I don't think we need to aim that high

Agree completely. 

14 hours ago, SwissDanny said:

Apart from the intro/outro most of the time your face/mouth is not the focus anyway so a voice-over rather than dub seems absolutely fine.

Again (I can't tell you how much Liv and I appreciate the contributions people are making here; thank you a thousand times), I agree completely. And I want to advertise and promote the dub voice person's name, too (and any contact details they might want promoted along the way); this group effort is what distinguishes our work, we feel.

[Kit_L]

Thanks to everyone here; check this out:

http://mailchi.mp/stretchtherapy/the-absolute-beginners-stretching-series-is-arriving-in-early-2018?e=63e47413e4

This is the first in a series of several email-outs; if you are not a subscriber, check back here and I will link to all of them.

[MarkusO]

Hi there! I gave the dubbing a try. A first quick test was done. First impression: Speaking in a Mic is easier than I thought, is more fun than I thought and is a lot of more work than I thought 

I dubbed the first minute of the Elephant Walk from Youtube and tried to say more or less the same things Kit is saying, in German of course. This took me a bit more than an hour for the first time ever dubbing anything.

Here is the very first result. My voice and the overall quality is improvable of course. The video is not listed on Youtube Kit, I can take it offline any time:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=onRDM0-Ysm0&feature=youtu.be

Here is what I think: This can work if we do it correctly. However, if you want 21 videos with 15 minutes each, there is no other way then to speak more freely in the translated versions. Otherwise this will be an awful amount of work if each minute takes an hour to record. I would think it would be better if the speaker would be acting as a kind of observer explaining the situation. Let me know what you think!

M

[Kit_L]

This is what I see when I load that URL. Tried with and without VPN.

Re. time it takes to do this kind of thing: 

43 minutes ago, MarkusO said:

there is no other way then to speak more freely in the translated versions.

I agree completely. Remember that I will be supplying a transcript of whatever we are saying, in English, and that will help a little. And the first one always takes the longest. And by all means try "acting as a kind of observer explaining the situation"; this is usually called "voice over" and some people can do it well. When I have tried it, I can never get the excitement or immediacy that 'talking while doing' gives, but everyone will be different in this regard. Please try a version with the same exercise, and see how that works.

[MarkusO]

Sorry, fixed the privacy issues. Try again!

[Kit_L]

Brilliant first attempt. My voice is distracting in the background, I feel; what I will do when I receive an alternative sound track is that, after adding the track, I will fade down my voice under the new track (so the viewer only hears the first few words); this gets the idea of the "replacement" voice over elegantly and also shows the viewer that they are listening to a second, translated, version of the instructions..

And be aware that you chose a difficult exercise to voice over—quite a few discursive remarks there (as usual); these can be dropped or simplified for timing, if necessary, I believe. 

Great work, my friend!

[SwissDanny]

2 hours ago, MarkusO said:

Hi there! I gave the dubbing a try. A first quick test was done. First impression: Speaking in a Mic is easier than I thought, is more fun than I thought and is a lot of more work than I thought 

I dubbed the first minute of the Elephant Walk from Youtube and tried to say more or less the same things Kit is saying, in German of course. This took me a bit more than an hour for the first time ever dubbing anything.

Here is the very first result. My voice and the overall quality is improvable of course. The video is not listed on Youtube Kit, I can take it offline any time:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=onRDM0-Ysm0&feature=youtu.be

Here is what I think: This can work if we do it correctly. However, if you want 21 videos with 15 minutes each, there is no other way then to speak more freely in the translated versions. Otherwise this will be an awful amount of work if each minute takes an hour to record. I would think it would be better if the speaker would be acting as a kind of observer explaining the situation. Let me know what you think!

M

@MarkusOFor a first attempt very good.  For sure there is a bit of technical tweaking and perhaps also diction to fine tune and practice. Kit's suggestion to fade the native track out makes total sense. 

When you say acting as observer, do you mean talking in the third person (ie "He puts his hands on his knees) or neutral voice ("Put your hands on your knees")? First person didnt sound strange to me. But I also think you dont have to do it verbatim as you have done.

@Kit_LIn terms of the transcripts, do these already exist? Im asking as maybe having them as close captions (ie with the timestamps) could serve a purpose for this cause (plus eg accessibility purposes). Just a thought. Also google/youtube will do its best at automatic cc and Im sure there are others out there.

I do think it confirmed my feeling the task will be easier if the videos have a bit more time latitude in the delivery. Markus had to talk pretty quick (but perhaps Ive been in Switzerland too long - we speak slower here!).

[MarkusO]

Hi again, thanks for the feedback guys. Some remarks from my side:

- First thing: Of course further practise and experimentation is required to find a reasonable workflow and optimal results in an acceptable amount of time. I think that in the next days/weeks this can be further clarified. I will try to write down what I actually did so other people have a guideline. 

- I think the workflow can certainly be improved. What I did in the first, foolish, attempt is to have the video in one window and the recording software in another window. This is not very optimal. Next time I try to export the audio and just work without the video. Having the two soundtracks (original and recording) in the same software will make for much better timings and quality.

- I stepped down the original audio to 20% as I find it nicer to have the original background noise in the video. Otherwise it feels too "clean". However, I will apply your suggestion and fade the audio out in the next attempt. 

- A transcript would be super helpful. I specifically chose a youtube video because the youtube transcription feature works very well. They also give you all the time stamps. Even the automatic translation works in some cases.

- I used Audacity (open source) for recording and a Rode NT-USB Mic. That combination worked out really well. Audacity is good enough for the job and can add some post processing which I have not applied yet. Moreover, an Australian Microphone gives the whole thing the right touch :-D

12 hours ago, SwissDanny said:

When you say acting as observer, do you mean talking in the third person (ie "He puts his hands on his knees) or neutral voice ("Put your hands on your knees")? First person didnt sound strange to me. But I also think you dont have to do it verbatim as you have done.

- Regarding the voice over I was probably not very clear. What I wanted to say is that I would speak in first person, still closely relating to what is said but not trying to translate every word. E.g., when Kit bends down and pus his hands onto his knees I would just say "Now I bend forward and put the hands onto my knees to support myself" (in German of course) without staying too close to what is actually being said. I will play a bit with that.

12 hours ago, SwissDanny said:

I do think it confirmed my feeling the task will be easier if the videos have a bit more time latitude in the delivery. Markus had to talk pretty quick (but perhaps Ive been in Switzerland too long - we speak slower here!).

- Exactly! It would be helpful for translators if speak in a slow and steady tempo across the whole video. E.g., see the original elephant video starting from 00:37. There are passages where Kit talks quite quickly. This is not a bad thing, I just noticed it takes longer to dub it. However: I feel as soon as one is aware of the fact that the voices will be dubbed, the problem will vanish as more care is taken automatically.

[Kit_L]

22 hours ago, SwissDanny said:

When you say acting as observer, do you mean talking in the third person (ie "He puts his hands on his knees) or neutral voice ("Put your hands on your knees")? First person didnt sound strange to me. But I also think you dont have to do it verbatim as you have done.

I feel it is critical to use simple, imperative sentences in dubbing for these programs: "Put your hands on your knees, then...". The tone of voice in English and Romance languages contains the politeness dimension (unlike Japanese; @Nathan may comment here). A simple, politely spoken order (that's what imperative means here: a simple order) is the most efficient way to get information across to another, and contains no sub-texts (e.g., "I'll just get you to turn over for me..." spoken by a therapist during a treatment; it is both inaccurate and it repositions the true locus of control). "Please" and "thank you" are likewise unnecessary in this context. This is my suggestion for ABS; I know I sometimes break this rule (and the EW video shows this) but in the ABS programs, I will stick to the imperative voice.

10 hours ago, MarkusO said:

What I did in the first, foolish, attempt is to have the video in one window and the recording software in another window.

I understand about not having any of the original sound in the end recording; let me do this in Final Cut Pro once we have your recordings, because I have the right gear here (audio monitors, etc., and can get the levels right. Remember I will be attaching your recordings to the original video file, and recompressing before uploading from here.

I agree, some atmosphere ("atmos" in the film world) is necessary. Perhaps we should consider making all non-English recordings shorter than the original track, so the beginning and ends in English can be faded down (and up); this will help to preserve the feel of the original. Good thinking.

The process is this: the original version will be compressed and output for upload; at the same time, I will make an audio-only version that I then send to a colleague for transcription (this is in place; thanks @AndeL!) and that transcription will be sent to all the Markuses out there!

10 hours ago, MarkusO said:

I used Audacity (open source) for recording and a Rode NT-USB Mic.

Beautiful; and I use Audacity too; it is an excellent program.

I will speak more carefully, and with less discursiveness than is usual for me: these will be as close to pure instruction as we can. All these ideas are SO helpful, and I think that, collectively, we will get this right. Liv and I will be making an intro video, too, that will talk about the core ideas; the actual follow-along programs will have only the instructions on how to do the exercises, and where to direct attention.

A general comment: all this discussion here is immensely useful; it is immensely clarifying. If we get all this right, we will have done something unique.

[Nathan]

3 hours ago, Kit_L said:

(unlike Japanese; @Nathan may comment here)

Indeed. The most basic imperative form in Japanese is quite strong/rough sounding, and would not be used in an instructional video. That said, while "politeness" may need to be added, other pieces may be subtracted. Like the subject, for example: "put your hands on your knees" becomes "put hands on knees" (oversimplified for illustrative purposes, of course).

3 hours ago, Kit_L said:

Perhaps we should consider making all non-English recordings shorter than the original track, so the beginning and ends in English can be faded down (and up); this will help to preserve the feel of the original.

I agree that this is a good idea. It's also quite common, I think. I'm not sure how you will be beginning the videos, but many of your YouTube videos start with a quick introduction. I imagine this part remaining and then transitioning to the foreign language track. You've often ended with a quick word of gratitude or encouragement, and fading the original back in just before that seems appropriate.

[Olga]

I watched Marcus's voice over - my first impression is that it was spoken extremely fast (we also speak slower here ... and of course my German is not anywhere fluent as my English). I would suggest that Kit instructs in the coming videos with non-native English speakers in mind as audience: keep it simple, precise, less colloquial and more standard English, and slower than usual. It will make the job of the translator so much easier.

[Nathan]

7 hours ago, Olga said:

I would suggest that Kit instructs in the coming videos with non-native English speakers in mind as audience: keep it simple, precise, less colloquial and more standard English, and slower than usual. It will make the job of the translator so much easier.

I make my livelihood as a translator, so I very much sympathize with this sentiment. That said, it should not be Kit's job to make the translation easier, especially if doing so would interfere in any way with his process, and thus the quality of the end product. Slowing things down should be simple enough in most cases, but changing wording, patterns of speech, etc. would require quite a bit of thought that could distract from the usual feeling/atmosphere and quality of the instruction. I realize that the "translators" are volunteers in this case, but I think that the usual quality and feel should not be sacrificed, even if it makes the job of the translator (to identify and translate the most important information, and then present it naturally in the target language) more difficult. Of course, if Kit can address these things without affecting his delivery, then that would be excellent!

[Kit_L]

I will be following Olga's advice for Nathan's reasons, and others: this explicitly is a program for beginners and we will be doing our best to confine the material to relatively simple instructions. I will leave gaps, too, deliberately. We will fade up from black, and have simple titles over the beginning into; the titles will be written in English, and Liv (and I, every second program) will simply describe the contents, "Now, hips and hamstrings, with one calf stretch" (for example), with either of us in a head and shoulders framing. This should be left as is, I believe, in the translated program, and as soon as the instructions starts (shot will change to a new angle), so too will the translation, and my (Liv's) voice will be faded under at this point. This will be a very simple intro (no opening titles or animations), and the super be just the contents of the program and its number, as "ABBS #4, hips, hamstrings, and calves"

Thus the stage is set: Liv and KL are the presenters, and the new voice is the translator's. Same at the end; we fade to black just after the last words. This way when playlists are assembled, no fluff, and creating the playlists made easy (the keyframe of each program will be selected to show the title).

[Tones]

Sorry I'm just going to drop in cold with my input...

Connect with influencers people who have a following, the link below is a good article with a bit of the how to and what to look for.

https://www.garyvaynerchuk.com/network-instagram-direct-message/

If you want to drum up a quick following,  for sure, Stretch Therapy, 100%, connect with this Ben Greenfield. He's got a massive following with his podcast and articles. He's in love with Paul Chek, ex-triahlete, ex-ironman ex-bodybuilding, current spartan racer,  and he's rehabbing re-occuring back injuries, so he'll 100% love Stretch Therapy. https://bengreenfieldfitness.com/contact/

 

In terms of marketing, this a good podcast Ben has done recently with the inventor of the bosu ball.

https://bengreenfieldfitness.com/podcast/the-bosu-ball-podcast-with-david-weck/